panel update

[Mike Stevens]

Hi Lloyd,

Depending on where the half wings ends, front and back, I guess there's little to choose between a half wing and an arch repair. The main difference is going to be a long (joddled) joint, either straight or round a curve. I can't see it makes much odds excpet maybe a straight one might be easier to get flat if there's been any heat distortion.

Dunno really. I guess it would also depend on how bad the tinworm is!

BTW, you're doing a great job.

Cheers,
Mike.

[TedTaylor]

For anyone who was not at the Spares Group meeting at Stoneleigh last March, and for which I have sent out the Minutes to those who were down as attending and people who subsequently showed an interest in the Group.

The matter of prices that people were prepared to pay was discussed and the following were agreed as a reasonable target price.

Mk2 front wing and arch repair panels – 1 piece £250 (in other words a half wing)
MK1 front valence £250
MK1 rear arch repairs £200
MK2 rear arch repairs £200

Obviously there has to be leeway on these prices but what Lloyd is quoting is within these guidelines.

Providing Lloyd gets the support he is due with orders he should end up with prices close to this - it all depends upon people supporting him now that he has done all this excellent work though we have to accept that a few people's circumstances change so plans have to change . Also the Spares Group would have been unable to find the investment required for tooling - even if there were £200 'investments by stakeholders' as was originally suggested we would have required 800 people to make the investment ...... Lloyd is putting this up himself in one go!

To be honest if you look at some of the prices people pay for wings for other makes of classic car these prices are cheap .......



MUT

[CAR]

When (in a former life) I owned an E9 BMW 3.0csi, front wings for that car were £500 each, this was in 1996!

Colin

[Steve G]

I haven't been reading anything about the panels elsewhere so I don't know whats going on properly.
The MK2 1/2 wings are expensive but I have been waiting for some for about 7 years now. I stopped using my car when the arches and front end of the sills started looking a bit crispy not knowing at the time repair panels were no longer available. One day I rang up to buy some and was told they would start re-making them in a few months once the press was sorted out and we all know how long thats been !

I've been around 2000s since the late 80's and have seen what people had to do to fix them then. Mk1 front arches, arches of other cars and even nasty fitting fibreglass ones. I couldn't believe this would be my only way to fix my car 12 years or so later so it's been sat in the garage since.

I've already said I would like some front wings, not actually sure how I am going to pay for them yet but thats another thing !

Is there anything else I can do to help make this happen ?

[Steve G]

Just a thought but is there any way scrap 1/2 wings could be used to make arch repairs ?
I guess if the tools have been made properly there won't be any, just a thought though.

[Lloydpiestate]

hi steve,

not quite sure what you ment by your last posting ? and yes the tooling will be made properly, its 3 part press draw tooling and will never lose its edge, will last a lifetime.

if i get the half wing tooling done it can also do arches, full arches with front and rear lower sections attatched, plus individual front and rear lower sections, but what im saying is, to press ( after checking the costings again ) say, a full arch on that tool works out only £3.50 cheaper than it does to press a full half wing, as the process for both is exactly the same, just £3.50 cheaper as you are using less metal.

if i get tooling done just to allow full arches to be made, than as the tooling is slightly cheaper than the half wing tooling, then the arches will be £30-40 cheaper than a half wing, but we wont be able to have half wings, and to have two sets of tooling made, to me anyway, is silly, plus im not prepared to make two sets of tooling, as they cost alot of dosh.

so surely the half wing tooling is a no brainer, as if i only make the arch tooling, we will never have availability of half wings, the difference in cost is so minimal, surely that is the way to go ???????

YOUR THOUGHTS PLEASE ON THAT TOPIC, AS I NEED TO KNOW WHAT YOU ALL WANT

thanks for your thoughts steve, always welcome

lloyd

[Steve G]

That last post wasn't really clear, it wasn't supposed to sound negative.
What I meant really was that if anything produced wasn't quite good enough someone could make use of it rather than chucking it in the bin. Wether this would help reduce the costs I don't know but anything could help.

[johnconradlee]

From my current perspective, I need both rear wheel arches reasonably soon and at some point in the future I will need a front half wing. The bottom of the wing is where they rust, hence where most people will need new metal and, if like my front wing, it has been badly repaired previously, people will need half wings. You can always cut off the bit you don't need!
However in the unlikely event (touch wood) that I do something silly like crash the car into a hedge, or buy a car where someone has fitted fibreglass wings it would be very comforting to know that re-manufactured whole wings were available. Obviously a whole wing tool would be more expensive, and I take it that the difference would make it uneconomic?

[Lloydpiestate]

hi mike,

half wings be will just that, half full wings running the complete length front to rear, including rear flange left at 90* ready to fold around the internal a post closure panel and including the front indicator housing flanges / rebates and holes.

steve,

thanks for clearing that up, but if there are any panels " not quite good enough " as you put it, i shall be having serious words with the manufacturer !!! lol.
the number of quality control checks are up to me to decide yet, 1 in every 5 , 1 in every 50 etc etc, but as the number of checks add to the overall cost, and as they are all done from the same tool and will all sit inside each other for stacking upon completion, any duff ones will be noticed anyway, im guessing ill have every 1 in 15 or so checked

john,

as you said regarding half wings, if you dont want it all, simply cut off what you do want, my thinking also.

complete full wings, again as you said, purely down to the cost of the tooling, and lack of a market for full wings, plus fitting a half wing is easier that fitting a complete one in my opinion and only in extreme cases are full ones ever needed .

also what alot of owners dont realise, is apart from the A post inner closure panel, the wing consists of 2 parts, the wing plus the top slam panel, thats the piece that runs front to back at the top of the wing, its only seen with the bonnet open, the bit where we all put our tools when working on the car lol !!!! so two lots of tooling need to be made, just not viable im afraid.

lloyd

[Lloydpiestate]

COPY OF CT POSTING


hi colin,

how you doing, well i hope.

good point about the half wings and it was one of the main reasons for wanting to do them instead of just the arches, and considering the small amount cost wise that the halves are compared to the arches, just cut out all the bodges, crap, filler and rust in one go along one straight line, ( making joddling eisier ) and hey presto, gleaming new metal on your beloved trumbie, yey !!!

all i need to get sorted now, asap are the inner outer bowls, its never ending lol lol.