possible future judging class ?

[red2000chris]

Me and my big mouth

[Alan Chatterton]

Only problem with that is to judge you really need to know what is right and what is wrong?

[Rob B]

Only problem with that is to judge you really need to know what is right and what is wrong?

and there lies the crux of the problem, are our cars now of an age where few are likely to be entirely standard and should we be judging on condition rather than merely on originality. Few clubs do their concours judging on originality alone anymore and as I have said already, there are any number of shows throughout the year where owners can enter their cars for competition, shows where they have official judges who sign up for the task.

The beauty of running our own nationals is that we can do it anyway we like.

If a practice has become a chore then you really need to consider whether its worth continuing.

[Mike Stevens]

Whilst I agree with the idea of having classes and judging at the National (and I was a Mk2 judge last year), I wonder if the criteria used for all the classes should be the same?

For example, should the class items for an everyday car be the same as best Mk2 (or Mk1)? My car has Rover seats which meant that I lost points for not being original, (I did have the original tool kit though so gained some there! ), but in general I just wonder if the criteria should also be aligned with the class rather than the same for all.

Judging for originality is also difficult. It may be just about impossible to keep to original parts and the judge has to know what is correct anyway. I'm lucky, I've been driving the big saloons since 1974 when I could go to the local Triumph agent and get OEM parts, so I (in general) know what they should look like. There were some very nice cars last weekend in fairly new ownership who have probably never had the luxury of being able to get OEM parts from a real Triumph agent.

Just my 4p worth!

Cheers,
Mike.

[Rob B]

Whilst I agree with the idea of having classes and judging at the National (and I was a Mk2 judge last year), I wonder if the criteria used for all the classes should be the same?

For example, should the class items for an everyday car be the same as best Mk2 (or Mk1)? My car has Rover seats which meant that I lost points for not being original, (I did have the original tool kit though so gained some there! ), but in general I just wonder if the criteria should also be aligned with the class rather than the same for all.

Judging for originality is also difficult. It may be just about impossible to keep to original parts and the judge has to know what is correct anyway. I'm lucky, I've been driving the big saloons since 1974 when I could go to the local Triumph agent and get OEM parts, so I (in general) know what they should look like. There were some very nice cars last weekend in fairly new ownership who have probably never had the luxury of being able to get OEM parts from a real Triumph agent.

Just my 4p worth!

Cheers,
Mike.

Agree entirely....... top post. The same point I was trying to make only explained far better.

[englishbull]

I said to Sharon and Derek that there should be a "used and cruised" class as Pete Sergeant ( yellow peril?) did an excellent job of getting his car on the road for the National and asked me what class I thought it should go in?
The only class it was worth of ( no malice intended) entering IMO was best resto but it was not a full blown resto eg paint etc..................

[Rob B]

I said to Sharon and Derek that there should be a "used and cruised" class as Pete Sergeant ( yellow peril?) did an excellent job of getting his car on the road for the National and asked me what class I thought it should go in?
The only class it was worth of ( no malice intended) entering IMO was best resto but it was not a full blown resto eg paint etc..................

Perhaps a class to recognise the most effort put in to get a car to a national? I remember a few times when I was a kid Dad mot'ing the car on the morning of our departure to the National. If anyone remembers his old Carmine estate that only made it to its first national in the early 90's by the skin of its teeth as it decided to pop a wheel cylinder on the MOT forecourt on the morning of departure day!

[englishbull]

Rolling resto class?

[johnconradlee]

There are issues with daily driver, I can see the point as a car that is regularly driven clearly isn't going to be concours, however the amount the car is used isn't assessed during the judging, which seems a bit silly. Also how do you define daily driver? - I drive my car everyday some weeks, not at all on other weeks. I have one car, if I need a car I use the Triumph. It would be extreme to say that you have to drive your car the 200 yards to the local shop on a Sunday so as to say you use it every day (I have legs, plus short journeys are not good for the engine!)

Thinking about something the middle of the fleet might be able to win, I was thinking maybe an award for the "Most Practical Triumph". With extra points awarded for "modifications for practicality", "number of tools in the boot", "spare parts carried", "extra lubricants and coolants" and "price and availability of tyres" on to of normal judging requirements of condition and originality. There probably ought to be separate prize for estates as there is more room for tools.......
To make judging faster and easier you could have a declaration filled in by the person being judged which could then be checked (20% at random?) by the judge (eg "You've declared a 1/4" drive socket set, a plug spanner, a tie rod separator and a junior hacksaw can I please see them?" and "May I please see the receipt for your tyres").

[raceyredcar]

Ahh judging, always guaranteed to get a reaction!! When 'heap of the week' category was scrapped there was talk of doing a 'triumph over adversity' award which I think should be looked at. There were many candidates for that award this year.

There's been a couple of offers to look at the forms, so maybe the board looks at judging (again) and reports back as per Alan's post