Indicator problem

[Alec]

Hello John,

the diagram in the official workshop manual is confusing where it shows the switch. I would have expected it to be drawn in the neutral position but the five contacts have a strap across 1 and 2 o'clock, and 3 and 4 o'clock (3 o'clock has no connection) which surely cannot be correct?

Both sides of repeater and warning light are common at the L/G P cable which goes back to the flasher relay P terminal. I'm guessing that that terminal goes live when the main indicators go off, if so then there must be an earth for each side in the indicator switch to make the circuit? However the diagram does show the horn earth but not the indicator ones if that is how it works.

Alec

[Clifford Pope]

No, I've done a test with a meter, on the car and on the spare switch assembly. They don't earth, they connect to the feed to the two lights on the other side, and are only "earthed" through those bulbs to the standard wing earths on the other side.

When the indicators are connected on the other side, the connections are all reversed.
It's utterly bizarre, and I can't find anything like it on any other car's wiring diagram.
If the appropriate warning light and repeater are only ever connected in series with other 12 volt bulbs, then they must have a lower rating to work despite the voltage drop?

[Alec]

Hello Cliff,

the repeater and warning lamps are not in series, it is just the way they are drawn, both pairs connect to a common point as I said. The earth path of those lamps is strange and not shown well in the diagram. If there is not an earth in the switch for them, then it must be in the flasher relay but that makes no sense whatsoever as it does not need that complication to the wiring?

Alec

[Alec]

Hello Cliff,

I've re drawn the diagram so as to get a better understanding.
If they are earthed through the main indicator lamps during an off pulse then the warning and repeater must be lit out of synch with the main indicators, is that the case? I.e. they are fed from the P terminal on the relay when the L terminal is off (A simple change over contact in the relay)?
I suppose it's one way of having a true warning light for if one or other of the main lamps is faulty the warning and repeater will not light either?

I know the internal contacts in the indicator switch don't make electrical sense as drawn but I just copied the workshop manual.

Alec

[johnconradlee]

That is correct (at least I think it is - I still don't quite understand the diagram), the repeater and dashboard light are 180 degrees out of phase with the front and rear indicators. If a bulb blows the non blown bulb is on almost constantly whilst the dashboard and repeater give one flash then presumably pluses so short and spaced out the filament doesn't give off any light.

[Alec]

Hello John,

if one of the indicator lamps blows then there is insufficient current to cause the relay to pulse and so the L feed to the warning lamp is permanently off and the P to the main indicators permanently on.
Your confirmation of the out of synch lighting of the main and warning makes me think my theory must be about right?

Alec

[Polly]

Perhaps you will already have worked this out for yourself, The circuit is rather unusually shown in the left turn situation, perhaps because the action is a little complicated to show the three possible positions in a single diagram. The 12v feed from the flash relay on green/brown is shown being fed to green/red and out to the left hand flasher lamps. Perhaps the bit that is misunderstood is
the P connection on the flash relay (the warning lamp output) and as suggested above in a previous post is only live when the main output is triggered off. This is fed to the switch via the LH side repeater and warning lamp on light green yellow, and out through Green white to earth via the right turn lamps. The current passed by the warning lamp and side repeater would be insufficient to illuminate the much larger flasher lamps (3w through two 21w bulbs)
What is not shown in the diagram, is the right turn position, where GN feeds to GW, and LG/U connects to GR.
I would imagine the reason for this seemingly unnecessary complication would have been the addition of side repeaters, had they been fed from the main relay output, they would have caused the thermally operated relay to flash too quickly.


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[red2000chris]

my early mk2 flashers flash much slower on right side than left side. are there separate relays for each side?

my slow right hand flasher turned out to be one of the bulbs was very slightly black on top, so was the green dash one, so.. new bulbs and now.. as fast as you like!