Mystery disappearing coolant

[TedTaylor]

It may be worth a trip to a local garage and to get them to pressure test the cooling system.It's not a big job,a little pump replaces the radiator cap and the system is pressurised.With the motor not going it may be possible to see or even hear any leaks.Good luck!!

Yes well said Tony I should have picked up on this bit of advice.

I bought a pressure tester at the autojumble at the Coleford Carnival of Transport this year (held every Easter Monday, Town Centre and car Parks closed for the day to be filled with vehicles ...... and its all free ). I had been mulling over investing in an SP kit but at between £130 and £180 depending upon specification I could not justify the investment. When I spotted this lovely old nickel plated kit for £8 (more or less equivalent to the more expensive one but without the box) I could not get my money out quick enough though I was upset that the seller would not accept £6 (it was an autojumble and you have got to try ..... ).

Used it twice so far.
1. To check out a persistent problem with my neighbour's Jeep. We could not identify whether the persistent fine leak was from the rad. or elsewhere because the front area of the engine is so cluttered and taking it apart is such a pain (thank God I am into Rangies which are much easier to work on). Any way I digress!!
Pumped the cooling system up to pressure and we could clearly identify the leak blowing out of a pin hole in the rad. Changed the rad - pain in the *ss job (horrible car to work on ) but problem solved.
2. Similar problem with the 90. Persistent water loss which seemed to be from the water pump but only evidence was a small patch of water under the car after it had been left standing ...... checked the water pump but nothing obvious. After making up an adaptor for the scew cap for the system I fitted the pressure tester and pumped up to pressure and a leak from water pump showed up immediately.

I am not saying that this bit of kit will solve every cooling problem but worked a treat on these occasions. If we could find a way of getting it to you (I go to Bristol Group Meetings) I would be very happy to lend it to you for a couple of weeks to see if it solves your problem, but postage (PO Parcels, it weighs just under 2lbs/800g) would cost about £12 each way so probably not cost effective.

Ted

[Mike Stevens]

Pressure testing is an excellent idea and with the engine cold (ish) it should squirt water rather than just hiss air.

I wouldn't write off the pipe behind the exhaust manifold. At the back they do corrode and could easily give a small jet of water onto the exhaust manifold which you'd never see if hot.

The pipe has either one or two outlets at the back, (1 I think for PI, 2 for carb? - I can't remember it's the old age!). I have found that where the hose fits, the pipe is often badly rusted. You should be able to wriggle the old pipe out and a new in without too much effort. If it stops raining that is!

Good luck and don't forget the oilskins.

Cheers,
Mike.

[Rob B]

It may be worth a trip to a local garage and to get them to pressure test the cooling system.It's not a big job,a little pump replaces the radiator cap and the system is pressurised.With the motor not going it may be possible to see or even hear any leaks.Good luck!!

Yes well said Tony I should have picked up on this bit of advice.

I bought a pressure tester at the autojumble at the Coleford Carnival of Transport this year (held every Easter Monday, Town Centre and car Parks closed for the day to be filled with vehicles ...... and its all free ). I had been mulling over investing in an SP kit but at between £130 and £180 depending upon specification I could not justify the investment. When I spotted this lovely old nickel plated kit for £8 (more or less equivalent to the more expensive one but without the box) I could not get my money out quick enough though I was upset that the seller would not accept £6 (it was an autojumble and you have got to try ..... ).

Used it twice so far.
1. To check out a persistent problem with my neighbour's Jeep. We could not identify whether the persistent fine leak was from the rad. or elsewhere because the front area of the engine is so cluttered and taking it apart is such a pain (thank God I am into Rangies which are much easier to work on). Any way I digress!!
Pumped the cooling system up to pressure and we could clearly identify the leak blowing out of a pin hole in the rad. Changed the rad - pain in the *ss job (horrible car to work on ) but problem solved.
2. Similar problem with the 90. Persistent water loss which seemed to be from the water pump but only evidence was a small patch of water under the car after it had been left standing ...... checked the water pump but nothing obvious. After making up an adaptor for the scew cap for the system I fitted the pressure tester and pumped up to pressure and a leak from water pump showed up immediately.

I am not saying that this bit of kit will solve every cooling problem but worked a treat on these occasions. If we could find a way of getting it to you (I go to Bristol Group Meetings) I would be very happy to lend it to you for a couple of weeks to see if it solves your problem, but postage (PO Parcels, it weighs just under 2lbs/800g) would cost about £12 each way so probably not cost effective.

Ted

My parents attend the Bristol group meeting, is there another meeting between now and Xmas? If so you could drop it off with them and i could pick it up when i see them on boxing day. I wouldnt be able to get it back to you until the new year tho.

I very much appreciate the offer.

Cheers, Rob

[Rob B]

had a degree of success this evening, if thats the right word for it.....

Went out to check that their was no signs of mayonaise forming under the rocker cover - good news is their isnt any. While i was there i thought their was no harm in running the engine and trying to see if i could spot the leak. Ive done this hundreds of times already to no avail but tonight i got lucky, or unlucky depending on how u look at it!

Engine had been running quite a while with no sign of a leak and was about to give up when suddenly i spotted a tiny drip from the bottom edge of the rad header tank. a second later and i could see a tiny amount of steam rising up from the front of the engine. Closer inspection revealed that the section of the header tank which has been welded up was weeping as well as a drip further along. As i was looking at this there was suddenly a massive jet of steam out of the bottom of the water pump, so this has gone too as i suspected.

Not sure if i only saw it tonight because its exceptionally cold or whether the problem has worsened to the degree where it was visible. Either way i at least know now what i need to do

Cheers for all the advice

[TedTaylor]

My parents attend the Bristol group meeting, is there another meeting between now and Xmas? If so you could drop it off with them and i could pick it up when i see them on boxing day. I wouldnt be able to get it back to you until the new year tho.

Steph and I are at the Group Dinner on Sunday if they are going to that. While what you have found with the rad and water pump may cure the problem there is no harm in pressurising the system after it is all done to make sure there is nothing else. No particular rush about getting it back to me - collection from your parents at the Feb Group Meet would be OK.

As it sounds that your rad has gone how are you off for a spare? I may have one that is useable.

Ted

[Forkie]

Rob,glad you have hopefully found the problem.That is always half the battle,FINDING the problem! Alec,whilst i was working on the 'S' this evening,thought i'd slip the mirror down the rear of the head and i could see at least two plugs.Deffinately head off to do them! Glad mine look good!Mike,i can vouch for two outlets on the carb models,one to the heater,and the other (at the bend) to the inlet manifold.This was where mine looked shot the most.

[Rob B]

My parents attend the Bristol group meeting, is there another meeting between now and Xmas? If so you could drop it off with them and i could pick it up when i see them on boxing day. I wouldnt be able to get it back to you until the new year tho.

Steph and I are at the Group Dinner on Sunday if they are going to that. While what you have found with the rad and water pump may cure the problem there is no harm in pressurising the system after it is all done to make sure there is nothing else. No particular rush about getting it back to me - collection from your parents at the Feb Group Meet would be OK.

As it sounds that your rad has gone how are you off for a spare? I may have one that is useable.

Ted

Thanks Ted, my parents are going to the dinner on sunday so that would be handy. Hopefully changing the pump and rad (i do have a spare, not sure how good it is but cant be any worse than whats on and at least it hasnt been welded up) will cure the problem sufficiently to drive the car down to my parents on boxing day. Might even be able to do the test while im down there, thus i wouldnt need to take it away with me and they could get it back to you at the next meeting.

Thanks for all your help, i really do appreciate it.

Incidentally i checked the pipe under the manifold and this seems fine.

[TedTaylor]

We'll take it with us on Sunday - make sure your parents introduce themselves to us because we don't know everyone yet.

We hope to be using the PI now that I have fixed the heater unless something untoward crops up. See new topic.

[Mike Stevens]

Great stuff! I think you may have just been looking at the right time. I have found that as the engine warms up and the thermostat begins to open, there is a great 'gush' of water into the rad and, if the cap is off, out of the rad too! (Don't ask how I know). I suspect that in normal circumstances this creates a pressure 'wave' in the header tank. Maybe you just happened to be looking at the correct time.

If the leak is around the seam between the header tank and the next bit down, it can successfully be soldered, (it's not welded). It will need a very good clean first (wire brush time) and then careful fluxing etc. Heat with a blowtorch and keep brushing with plumbers flux as this will also help to clean it. I then feed in ordinary Ersin Multicore solder. You have to be careful that the heat from the torch doesn't melt the solder further along.

Of course, if you don't feel like this sort of soldering it could mean a new rad. Not too cheap though!

Good luck!

Cheers,
Mike.

[Rob B]

Great stuff! I think you may have just been looking at the right time. I have found that as the engine warms up and the thermostat begins to open, there is a great 'gush' of water into the rad and, if the cap is off, out of the rad too! (Don't ask how I know). I suspect that in normal circumstances this creates a pressure 'wave' in the header tank. Maybe you just happened to be looking at the correct time.

If the leak is around the seam between the header tank and the next bit down, it can successfully be soldered, (it's not welded). It will need a very good clean first (wire brush time) and then careful fluxing etc. Heat with a blowtorch and keep brushing with plumbers flux as this will also help to clean it. I then feed in ordinary Ersin Multicore solder. You have to be careful that the heat from the torch doesn't melt the solder further along.

Of course, if you don't feel like this sort of soldering it could mean a new rad. Not too cheap though!

Good luck!

Cheers,


Mike.

Thanks for the info

The header tank does seem to be leaking at the seam with the Rad as you say, however it has been pierced at some point on the tank itself and the hole has been welded up - and it def is weld and not solder. This now seems to have gone porous as there seemed to be a weep from it. Happily i have a spare rad, im not sure if its totally watertight but its in much better nick than the one thats on, so should be a better basis for a repair even if it does leak. The jet of steam from the waterpump however was by far the bigger leak so im gonna change that at the same time.

Cheers