Any DVLA Experts on Here ?

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Steve G
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Any DVLA Experts on Here ?

#1 Post by Steve G » Tue Feb 03, 2015 3:19 pm

This isn't about my Triumph, it's another car I own.
I seem to have bought a car that should be tax free but isn't because someone has previously swapped the logbook.
I have tried asking DVLA about what to do and they say to send my logbook to them along with any details/proof of the cars real identity to them and they will sort it out.
I am worried if I surrender my logbook I probably won't get one back again. Fortunately I have the chassis number (found stamped on the chassis under the paint) and reg number that the car should have so they will know where to go looking.

Has anyone been in a similar position and can offer any advice on whether this is the best way forward or would just applying for the proper logbook do the same job.

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CAR
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Re: Any DVLA Experts on Here ?

#2 Post by CAR » Tue Feb 03, 2015 6:34 pm

Are you a member of the owners club for that particular car? They should have someone who can advise on that particular model when this has happened.
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Steve G
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Re: Any DVLA Experts on Here ?

#3 Post by Steve G » Tue Feb 03, 2015 9:58 pm

CAR wrote:Are you a member of the owners club for that particular car? They should have someone who can advise on that particular model when this has happened.
Thats what the DVLA asked ! Trouble is since I bought the car the person who I bought it from seems to have made himself more important within the club and is now an area rep, it puts the guy who sorts out the DVLA side of things in a bit of a difficult position.

Thanks for the reply though.

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Re: Any DVLA Experts on Here ?

#4 Post by johnnydog » Wed Feb 04, 2015 12:40 am

I might be missing something here, but surely if you are 100% certain on the cars true identity from this permanent chassis no. (not just a VIN plate), then surely you would be able to establish when it was last on the road from the DVLA site, and if it has had a registration document issued by the DVLA in the past (rather that the old type green log book), could you not change its identity back, with the correct plates, and VIN plate, take it for an MOT, and then apply for a registration document as a new keeper? You would of course have to technically scrap the 'other' car permanently. You aren't doing anything illegal, I would argue, if you are certain about the cars identity.
If you aren't absolutely certain on its true identity, then I wouldn't advocate this line of approach, until you are.
You may have to get an inspection done on the vehicle anyway (possibly by a Club Official - Andy Roberts was the point of contact the Register for this type of query for example), but I don't know now how the DVLA would go about examining it - in the past you simply made an appointment at a DVLA LVLO office for this, but as the LVLO offices are no more......?
Why someone would change a now tax exempt car to a later one is a bit of a mystery, unless it was done purely for snobbery value for a newer reg, but obviously prior to the 25 year (as it was) exemption coming in.
Any other thoughts on this?
I am certainly not suggesting anything illegal is done with the car, and I can't see how this would cross any boundaries.....
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1967 Mk1 2000 in Gunmetal Grey
1969 Mk1 2000 in Royal Blue
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1973 Mk2 2.5 PI in Sienna Brown
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Re: Any DVLA Experts on Here ?

#5 Post by Steve G » Wed Feb 04, 2015 10:00 am

I should have said the car in question is an incomplete rusty and slightly bent kit car ! I don't want to go spending lots of time and cash rebuilding it so apart from the chassis number there isn't a lot for anyone to inspect.
I was tempted to just apply for a logbook but you need confirmation from the previous owner the sale of the car has taken place.
Unfortunately the owners club have done a good job so far in slowing me down in sorting things out so far but they now know the situation and don't want the bad publicity so I will see what happens.

Thanks for the reply, there is lots of stuff I hadn't considered, cheers.

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Re: Any DVLA Experts on Here ?

#6 Post by Mike Stevens » Wed Feb 04, 2015 12:40 pm

As far as I am aware, the DVLA will accept the word of a club official as to the build date etc of the vehicle. OK, so that may not help too much in your case, but at the end of the day, the club should be concerend about its cars and their owners, so maybe push it further up the 'official' chain. That's what I would do.

I have a similar issue with my LandRover. To anyone in the know, it is definately a 1949 model, but the registration document (with the reg number on it) says it is 1951! So, I would be interested to hear how you get on!

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(1949 LandRover was blue should be light green!)

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Re: Any DVLA Experts on Here ?

#7 Post by Steve G » Wed Feb 04, 2015 1:27 pm

I've spoken to the club president (not a Triumph club) and while he wants to help and prevent the club getting a bad name he suggested that perhaps I hadn't paid enough to expect a tax free logbook ! :shock:

Your Land Rover sounds like it has a bit of a story attached. If it was a 70's british car I wouldn't be surprised if it had sat about for a couple of years. My Father had a company Marina Estate that had been fully re-sprayed before he got it !
Could yours have been abroad and then re-registered when it came back to the UK ?

If I wasn't so fed up with whats been happening I would quite enjoy the challenge of finding stuff out like this. I worked out the reg number on my car by looking at the marks where the old plastic number plate digits had rubbed the paint. Fortunately there were two J's, one was part of the area code the rest were just best guessed. First one I typed into the AA reg checker came up good with the correct title, one HPI check later to check the chassis number matched and it was done. I've missed the parts out about how many hours I spent just looking at it but I would of only been asleep otherwise !

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Re: Any DVLA Experts on Here ?

#8 Post by johnnydog » Wed Feb 04, 2015 9:59 pm

What you say now puts it in a different light as I didn't know the car was in such a dilapidated state!
It is highly likely your car is made up of bits from numerous cars, but being a kit car, the task of verifying the correct registration to the DVLA is more difficult, I would think! From what you say, convincing the DVLA of its id from the marks from the registration numbers might be easier said than done!
I don't know whether it still applies, but when a vehicle was being assessed for registration purposes, I understand a points system was used, and certain components that could related to that vehicle (such as the chassis/body, engine etc) qualified for a greater number of points. If the vehicle didn't attain the required points, it went on a 'Q' plate as the date of manufacture couldn't reasonably be established. However 'Q' plates have not been issued for some time. Possibly you would need to be able to show that the majority of parts on the car actually relate to the reg number you want on the vehicle.
I went through this process with the DVLA with a 2.5PI that I bought some years ago that had never been registered with the DVLA and only had a green log book. In this case I asked a Club Official (Andy Roberts) to confirm with them that the vehicle was the actual car that I wished to register, AND that it was of historical interest to retain the original registration mark, otherwise I would have had have a new 'age related' registration which obviously takes away the vehicles history. The green log book on its own wasn't enough!
From my experience of the DVLA, they seem to employ the same type of clerks as the old CSA.....straight forward dealings, no problem, but give them something out of the ordinary and no one seems to able to give a definitive and correct answer!
Good luck!
Register Member no. 1596

1967 Mk1 2000 in Gunmetal Grey
1969 Mk1 2000 in Royal Blue
1970 Mk2 2000 in Valencia Blue
1972 Mk2 2.5 PI in Triumph White
1973 Mk2 2.5 PI in Sienna Brown
1976 Mk2 2500S in Carmine Red

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Steve G
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Re: Any DVLA Experts on Here ?

#9 Post by Steve G » Wed Feb 04, 2015 11:57 pm

The only way to deal with the DVLA is by filling out the forms and sending them. As you say if it isn't anything normal the people you speak to really can't offer any advice, the worst thing is we pay for it to be like this !
I can only wait and see what happens.

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Re: Any DVLA Experts on Here ?

#10 Post by Mike Stevens » Thu Feb 05, 2015 1:06 pm

Steve G wrote:I've spoken to the club president (not a Triumph club) and while he wants to help and prevent the club getting a bad name he suggested that perhaps I hadn't paid enough to expect a tax free logbook !
I find that quite a disturbing statement. It implies that you could have had the same car but with a 'free tax logbook' if you'd paid more! It sounds like there is some fraud going on somewhere.

If at all possible, it might be worth considering walking away from the deal, but I suspect it's gone too far for that. You might be able to use the fraud bit as a lever though.

I wonder who might be interested. Trading standards? Police (I doubt it)? Any other ideas?

Cheers,
Mike.
(South Oxfordshire)
Register Member No 0355
1971 2.5PI Saloon Sapphire blue
1973 2.5PI Saloon rust some Honeysuckle
1973 Stag French blue
(1949 LandRover was blue should be light green!)

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